ENGAGING WITH GOVERNMENT

Our Learning: Engagement with Scottish Government
During the second year of the Panel, we engaged with Scottish Government officials in different ways. These included:

• taking part in subgroups with National Advisory Council members to discuss gender budgeting and public sector equality duty;
• a learning conversation with School Age Childcare Policy Team followed by a workshop;
• our second Accountability Event in Edinburgh in February 2025;
• following up on pledges made at the first Accountability Event in 2024 (you can read more about the pledges here). 

Subgroups
Our meetings with government officials about gender budgeting and the public sector equality duty often felt less than fruitful. While there was a willingness to hear our lived experience, the tone sometimes reverted to defensiveness and a list of what was in the pipeline, rather than actively listening or answering us truthfully.

It’s true that some of the officials we spoke to felt more comfortable sharing the real issues with us than others. This is what we were always looking for - so we want to shine a light on this good practice and hope that others will follow suit in future interactions with us and other lived experience panels.

There were times when there was an openness about the failures in the system and a recognition of the impacts of that. But at other times, some officials were less open and more defensive and some didn’t engage at all during meetings. This felt tokenistic and like we were excluded from the discussion.

We don’t want to feel that our efforts are a waste of time and that we’re going to keep getting the same answers to the same questions. We want to know how and when things are going to happen, even if it’s baby steps. We appreciate honesty and transparency because then it feels like we’re all on the same page and we can collaborate and move forward.
 
Learning Conversation and Workshop
When we spoke to Government officials as part of a learning conversation it felt a bit different. We led the session and we had worked hard in advance with attendees to create an atmosphere that encouraged open and honest dialogue. In this environment, we found the officials were able to open up and speak to us about what it’s really like to work within the constraints of Government.

They told us that they need access to better information, training and support so that they can carry out their responsibilities under the Public Sector Equality Duty more easily. This included access to high-quality disaggregated equalities data, as well as working more closely with lived experience and other experts – including their own colleagues in Scottish Government – so that they’re not working in a silo. They also told us that more time and capacity is needed to make this work well.

We realised that they were all really passionate and want to do the work to make change but we got the impression that they sometimes feel like they’re playing a giant game of chess. Lived experience is vital for them to make sure that their policies are relevant and they do understand the value of this. However, we heard about some of the barriers that they face within their own system, and we can imagine how that must feel really frustrating at times. 

The pledge made by the School Age Childcare Policy Team was “To better include the voices of marginalised women and girls within our engagement and co-design work of the School Age Childcare Programme”.  This led to a joint workshop which involved Scottish Government officials, Panel members and our peers. 

The workshop was run by arts and theatre company Active Enquiry and included lots of interactive drama exercises.  Lots of us hadn’t met before that day, but the format really helped us to feel comfortable and to talk openly about our experiences and needs in relation to childcare.

Scottish Government officials joined in the exercises with us which meant like we all felt like equals.  We didn’t feel the same imbalance of power that we have felt before when engaging with Government.  Instead, it felt like we were all working together to solve a problem.  This felt positive for us and like our voices might actually make a difference.

We hope to follow up with this team to see how School Age Childcare Programme develops.  We would also like to work more with Scottish Government officials in this way.
 
Accountability Event
We decided not to share the lived experience care stories at the Accountability Event in February 2025.  So far, we have found that sharing our personal experiences of day-to-day life has not led to any real or lasting change. We are more than just stories.

Instead, we shared our learning from our interactions with Government and other professionals.  We wanted to hold up a mirror - not to be negative, but to help decision-makers see themselves and the key issues through our eyes and through the eyes of the professionals we spoke to.  They have the power to make things better for women and girls like us, so it is up to them to lead the change. 

We could tell that what we shared was uncomfortable to hear for some, but in general we found that people responded well and were genuinely interested in hearing our views. 

We often found it easier to connect with officials and share our views during breaks and away from the formality of the round table discussions, where it can be harder for some of us to speak up.  We found most officials to be very approachable and felt that they saw us as human beings and respected us.

Through slowly building these connections and relationships we feel like we are learning to trust each other a little more.  We think that this helped some Scottish Government officials to be more open and honest and admit where things are going wrong.  As a Panel, honesty and openness is what we are looking for. 
 
Reflections
It still isn’t clear to us what changes will be made to gender equality from the work we have done with Government over the last two years. What we need to see now are lessons being learned, which turn into actions that make real and lasting differences to the lives of women and girls like us. 
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We hope that by building a stronger partnership with Government we can try to make a difference together, but we also recognise that responsibility has to lie with those in power.  We want all the officials we have met to become real champions for gender equality - holding themselves to account for successes and failures and not being satisfied until real changes are made.